Ended Small Vanilla Mafia: Mafia Victory

AndyM03 said:

from the perspective of a vanilla boi I don't think we'd have the info to reliably detect the mafia counter claim.

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Four posts in, and you already lost the game. After Firedemon's post, I figured he was a vanilla townie, since he wouldn't do all that math shit if he was scum, and he wouldn't put himself out there if he had a power role. I knew that between Jeroth and Andy, one of them was scum and the other was the doc. Since I'm a vanilla townie, that means whichever of the two of you claims that role is lying.

Unless Firedemon actually is the Doctor, in which case it could be either of you.

This is the exact opposite of what happened last game.

My whole post was doubting, (Well, really more double checking), Firedemon's outlined scenario in which we could rely on vanilla townies to have all the information needed to win the game. I wasn't really claiming anything in that post, and really was sort of speaking from the exact experience we had last game where I was a vanilla townie and dealing with a claim/counter-claim scenario. While that situation had a lot of different factors, the mafia went head strong into a "We are totally confirmed for these roles and the counter claim is confirmed false". This scenario is really only worth looking at from the perspective of a vanilla townie, as they have the smallest subset of information that all players have. (Though obviously power roles can still be fooled, *COUGH* FIREDEMON ).

I can understand how it looked like I was claiming, but I don't like how forcefully you've pushed that interpretation. Assuming Firedemon is town because he can do maths is pretty funny too (Even though if i'm honest i'm thinking the same thing, but I wouldn't be confident in claiming it out loud), especially since until last game he had a pretty bad rap for inactivity and could easily be making up for that. In fact, doing maths is pretty much a textbook Firedemon play regardless of affiliation, but I digress.

Firedemon said:

So the reason counter claiming is irrelevant is you have one of two situations

Doctor claims and identifies protected townie
Mafia counter claims and has to identify a protected townie as well

So now we have two confirmed townies and two remaining uncertainties. Alternatively,

Doctor claims and identifies protected townie
Mafia doesn't counter claim

Now the doctor and protected townie are confirmed, and there are two remaining uncertainties.

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Are townies usually told when they've been protected at night? I feel like this could vary game to game because I don't recall that being a thing. Maybe you fuckers just never protect me though.

@Jeroth game has started btw.

I'm still happy to no lynch, but I would have liked a conclusive response to my post rather than a gif. It's bit of a cop out for someone who avoids actions that 'limit information'.

You completely deflated my argument, which was based on the misinterpretation that you were roleclaiming. I guess this means you're tacitly claiming the doc role, but then again, you can't claim anything else (unless FD comes in to deflate THAT theory by claiming doc himself). From my perspective, it's between you and Jeroth.

By the way, I thought the whole appeal of having a tiny manlet sized mafia game was that we could count on all the players being active. So much for that, thanks to @Jeroth.

My gut's telling me it's gonna turn out to be Jeroth, but I think me and Andy are gonna have to do a few trust falls before we're ready to kill him off.

Dunsparce said:

You completely deflated my argument, which was based on the misinterpretation that you were roleclaiming. I guess this means you're tacitly claiming the doc role, but then again, you can't claim anything else (unless FD comes in to deflate THAT theory by claiming doc himself). From my perspective, it's between you and Jeroth.

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My intent for the day was to keep my cards close to my chest, for the eventual day 2 meta role reveals, that way scum can't do any accurate guesstimates in the night, keeping it to the pure chance that Firedemons been spinning up. So I promise i'm not dropping any subtle hints.

Yeah haha I wasn't sure how to reply to the gif, considering you had just misunderstood me I was like, I'd feel bad replying straight away and potentially doing the exact same thing.

I'm pretty suspicious of Jeroth as well but really that's just process of elimination, it would be nicer to have somewhat of a character profile on him before the day ends. Just as likely he's our inactive Anatron saviour...

AndyM03 said:

@Jeroth game has started btw.

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Dunsparce said:

By the way, I thought the whole appeal of having a tiny manlet sized mafia game was that we could count on all the players being active. So much for that, thanks to @Jeroth.

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Yeah, sorry. There was a post about math and I wasn't about to dive into that.

Dunsparce said:

Four posts in, and you already lost the game. After Firedemon's post, I figured he was a vanilla townie, since he wouldn't do all that math shit if he was scum, and he wouldn't put himself out there if he had a power role. I knew that between Jeroth and Andy, one of them was scum and the other was the doc. Since I'm a vanilla townie, that means whichever of the two of you claims that role is lying.

Unless Firedemon actually is the Doctor, in which case it could be either of you.

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So what you're telling me is you don't know anything and you're just suspicious of everyone. It seems like you're doing your usual hyper-aggressive gameplay of lashing out with the addition of questioning your own gut feeling a few sentences later.

AndyM03 said:

I can understand how it looked like I was claiming, but I don't like how forcefully you've pushed that interpretation. Assuming Firedemon is town because he can do maths is pretty funny too (Even though if i'm honest i'm thinking the same thing, but I wouldn't be confident in claiming it out loud), especially since until last game he had a pretty bad rap for inactivity and could easily be making up for that. In fact, doing maths is pretty much a textbook Firedemon play regardless of affiliation, but I digress.

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Welcome to what, Dunsparce does. Math is probably one of the safest bets in terms of neutral posting in mafia. It's saying a lot on the situation without commenting on it.


Firedemon - ?? - Analytical,
Dunsparce - ?? - Claim Vanilla Townie
Andy - ?? - Power Role(?)
Jeroth - I'm a vanilla townie.


For now, we need a unanimous lynch of 3 in order to hammer someone. This is why I'm surprised we started with 4 instead of 5. In this event, I would suggest a no lynch (which will probably happen). I'm not happy about it and I usually never concede to no lynching the first day, but considering the starting number of players doesn't benefit the town at all; it doesn't make sense to lynch, which is why I'm suspicious of @Dunsparce

Speaking of which,

No Lynch.

It's too risky to try to lynch today.

Yeah I was surprised how (relatively for a day 1 almost-initial post) strongly Dunsparce supported Firedemon after a neutral math post for those reasons exactly. However I at least understood it from a personable "Could the bloke really be bothered to do the math if he wasn't townie?" But considering Firedemons scientific credentials, the answer to that is probably yes... But yeah, I kind of admitted myself it won me over slightly, but with the awareness that it probably shouldn't have.

I'm pretty happy with Jertoh's post overall (content wise, not townie or scummy wise), and yeah I think we're all in agreement for a day 1 no lynch, was just waiting for some initial postings before jumping in to it.

I'd like another post from Firedemon before hammering, but besides that i'll also throw in an official vote:
No lynch.

Jeroth said:

So what you're telling me is you don't know anything and you're just suspicious of everyone. It seems like you're doing your usual hyper-aggressive gameplay of lashing out with the addition of questioning your own gut feeling a few sentences later.

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Wow, you got me all figured out, don'tcha? You figured out that I'm playing this game in the completely normal default way that everyone plays this game all the time. You've seen straight through my warm facade and into my very soul.

Jeroth said:

Jeroth - I'm a vanilla townie.

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I'm surprised you actually made that claim, 'cause like I said, whichever of the two of you claims that role must be lying. You're 100% confirmed scum to me now, the only problem is getting everyone else to trust me, which you're really grasping at straws trying to prevent.

Jeroth said:

it doesn't make sense to lynch, which is why I'm suspicious of @Dunsparce

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Nice try, Slick, but I never voted to lynch anybody. All I did was try to figure out who the scum was, which is kinda the town's fucking goal.

AndyM03 said:

Yeah I was surprised how (relatively for a day 1 almost-initial post) strongly Dunsparce supported Firedemon after a neutral math post for those reasons exactly. However I at least understood it from a personable "Could the bloke really be bothered to do the math if he wasn't townie?" But considering Firedemons scientific credentials, the answer to that is probably yes... But yeah, I kind of admitted myself it won me over slightly, but with the awareness that it probably shouldn't have.

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If Firedemon was scum, he definitely wouldn't have done all those calculations, because it maximized the chances for the town. If he can do that math, he can figure out that it's not worth the risk just to make us think he's probably town.

Hypothetically we could win this game today if we all agree to lynch Jeroth, but I have no expectation of that happening. I'm okay with the no lynch, but I'd like to hear from Firedemon one last time.

Also, I think I've been playing this game wrong. I've been trying to figure shit out, and also help the town figure shit out, but in doing so I think I've delivered a lot of info to the scum as well. Guess my usual strats don't work in a game like this.

Dunsparce said:

Wow, you got me all figured out, don'tcha? You figured out that I'm playing this game in the completely normal default way that everyone plays this game all the time. You've seen straight through my warm facade and into my very soul.

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Oh yeah, definitely. It's more the fact that you have no clue about what you're saying and you're acting like you have some sense.

Dunsparce said:

I'm surprised you actually made that claim, 'cause like I said, whichever of the two of you claims that role must be lying. You're 100% confirmed scum to me now, the only problem is getting everyone else to trust me, which you're really grasping at straws trying to prevent.

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Dunsparce said:

I knew that between Jeroth and Andy, one of them was scum and the other was the doc.

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Dunsparce said:

My gut's telling me it's gonna turn out to be Jeroth, but I think me and Andy are gonna have to do a few trust falls before we're ready to kill him off.

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So it went from 50/50 to 100% confirmed because I... posted? And in a matter that challenged your thought process. Oh wow, jeeze.

Dunsparce said:

Nice try, Slick, but I never voted to lynch anybody. All I did was try to figure out who the scum was, which is kinda the town's fucking goal.

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Dunsparce said:

My gut's telling me it's gonna turn out to be Jeroth, but I think me and Andy are gonna have to do a few trust falls before we're ready to kill him off.

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Huh. Fancy how I got that interpretation. You went from: "We're probably going to kill Jeroth" to "Oh god, he posted, let me get him."

Dunsparce said:

If Firedemon was scum, he definitely wouldn't have done all those calculations, because it maximized the chances for the town. If he can do that math, he can figure out that it's not worth the risk just to make us think he's probably town.

Hypothetically we could win this game today if we all agree to lynch Jeroth, but I have no expectation of that happening. I'm okay with the no lynch, but I'd like to hear from Firedemon one last time.

Also, I think I've been playing this game wrong. I've been trying to figure shit out, and also help the town figure shit out, but in doing so I think I've delivered a lot of info to the scum as well. Guess my usual strats don't work in a game like this.

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I feel like you're tootin' your own horn a bit too much there, bud.

All in all, there isn't much information to really be found and most of the meat seems to be on Day 2. We just have to see if the doctor can save someone.

Jeroth said:

So it went from 50/50 to 100% confirmed because I... posted? And in a matter that challenged your thought process. Oh wow, jeeze.

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It went from 50/50 to 100% confirmed because you claimed to be vanilla townie, which isn't possible because there's only two of them in the game, me and Firedemon (which he could disprove any time, which is why I want to let him post first). I don't know why I'm even bothering to explain this when I actually explained it in the fucking post you're quoting. This isn't even stupidity, it's just a blatant misrepresentation of what I said.

Sorry, was busy over the weekend. I'll catch up tonight.

Dunsparce said:

It went from 50/50 to 100% confirmed because you claimed to be vanilla townie, which isn't possible because there's only two of them in the game, me and Firedemon (which he could disprove any time, which is why I want to let him post first). I don't know why I'm even bothering to explain this when I actually explained it in the fucking post you're quoting. This isn't even stupidity, it's just a blatant misrepresentation of what I said.

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Except for the fact that Firedemon never claimed vanilla townie at all. He also encouraged for us to claim since it's advantageous without initially starting the claim.

Dunsparce said:

If Firedemon was scum, he definitely wouldn't have done all those calculations, because it maximized the chances for the town. If he can do that math, he can figure out that it's not worth the risk just to make us think he's probably town.

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He's appearing pro-townie and he did the math. You don't want to lynch him - you want either me or Andy dead. That seems like it was well worth it if he's scum.

Dunsparce said:

This isn't even stupidity, it's just a blatant misrepresentation of what I said.

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I typed that up on my lunch break hastily. All in all, what I'm getting at: You don't know anything. Stop assuming firedemon is a townie because he posted math and disappeared.

Actually, funny story, I've been reading/writing/analyzing for like two hours and have finally come to a rather sudden decision... I'm the doctor. I can self protect. I am going to self protect and force the situation where it's me, a townie, and the scum.

Talk amongst yourselves until day end, potential scumlords.

Firedemon said:

I'm the doctor.

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FUCK.

I thought for sure Jeroth was scum, and he was just sayin' shit to try and get me killed tomorrow, but now he could just as easily be a vanilla townie doing regular scumhunting. I'm right back to square one like Jeroth said.

Fuck it. There's nothing else to be learned from today, let's just cut to the chase. No Lynch

Thats 3 votes!

There is no lynch today.

It is now Night 1, for up to 48 hours. Send in your night actions. No talking in this thread pls.

Shitposting of that quality is acceptable night talk.