So, Kylo Ren vs. Artanis... discuss with spoiler tags as necessary. My money's on Artanis, for obvious reasons.
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Star Wars: The Force Awakens
- Thread starter Colonel Thunder
- Start date
So, Kylo Ren vs. Artanis... discuss with spoiler tags as necessary. My money's on Artanis, for obvious reasons.
So reading 13ths thoughts has made me realize that it's even more important now to watch the prequels. Not just because it helps build the world, but because it shows you just how much TFA redeemed the franchise.
And how much more sense would the world make if Naboo and Alderaan were the same planet as originally intended, before George Lucas decided that Gungans were likable and ought not to be the victims of genocide.
What the fuck kind of matchup is that? Kylo Ren is a Padawan-tier scrub baby.
This is a fair point.
This is what I meant. He's obviously not a Sith Lord by any means, but he has the talent to become one, with training. His mother was a Skywalker, was she not?
The reason why I make the Lord Vader/Darth Sidious comparison is because (according to the prequels, which I realize is shaky ground to base any opinion on), there are only ever two Sith. The master and the apprentice. So Snoke is the master, and Ren is the apprentice. He strives to be the Vader he thinks he can become. If we are to throw out that logic (because it's actually kinda stupid, why can't there be many Sith as there were Jedi?), then Kylo Ren and Snoke are the only Sith we know of at this point, so I think the comparison is fair. He's not nearly as powerful as Vader, but with the completion of his training, as is alluded to at the end of VII, he could be.
There were only ever two Sith in the movies because of Darth Bane's Rule of Two demanding it in the hopes of the Sith surviving a long time; before this rule, the Sith made empires, formed armies, and etcetera, but kept getting badly wrecked by the Jedi (as well as collapsing in on one another) - so Bane thought that they should keep hidden to avoid this fate. Given that the Rule of Two led to the near-total destruction of the Jedi (realized through Palpatine), it seems to have had merit.
While there certainly could be more Sith, whether or not it's a good idea is debatable, owing to their self-destructive tendencies. Furthermore, Snoke was/is presumably not one of the Sith, as the Rule of Two was in place until Vader and Sidious both died; while he could have obtained knowledge of the Sith, he would essentially be declaring himself a Sith Lord. Extending the same title to Kylo Ren is very, very generous.
...And no, I very much doubt that Kylo Ren could be as powerful as Vader, whether or not he completes his training. He's at the point that he would still lose a fight to Episode II Anakin, and against actual Vader he'd do even worse.
While there certainly could be more Sith, whether or not it's a good idea is debatable, owing to their self-destructive tendencies. Furthermore, Snoke was/is presumably not one of the Sith, as the Rule of Two was in place until Vader and Sidious both died; while he could have obtained knowledge of the Sith, he would essentially be declaring himself a Sith Lord. Extending the same title to Kylo Ren is very, very generous.
...And no, I very much doubt that Kylo Ren could be as powerful as Vader, whether or not he completes his training. He's at the point that he would still lose a fight to Episode II Anakin, and against actual Vader he'd do even worse.
I'm not usually an advocate of genocide, but...
While this is all true if you look at the Expanded Universe and normally I would agree with everything you said, however we have to take in mind that Disney did declare the entire EU not cannon. Though the Rule of Two is briefly mentioned in Episode I making it cannon, the rules are never explained (in the movies) only that there is always two a master and an apprentice. It has also been over 30 years since the death of Sidious and Vader, plenty of time for Snoke to rise to power even if he started from nothing. Even if we do still consider the EU cannon Snoke would not be the first to declare himself a Sith Lord with no formal Sith training.
One thing to also take note is that the title Sith Darth is never used in Episode VII. Not for Snoke or for Kylo Ren. This (even though the EU is no longer cannon) leads me to believe this is an entirely new Sith order that isn't bound by the old ones restraints.
One thing to also take note is that the title Sith Darth is never used in Episode VII. Not for Snoke or for Kylo Ren. This (even though the EU is no longer cannon) leads me to believe this is an entirely new Sith order that isn't bound by the old ones restraints.
EU may no longer be canon, but Darth Bane is still canon to some extent, albeit only in that his ghost appears in an episode of The Clone Wars (the new, canon one).
The old republic era in general is still canon.
Also, prepare for the feels.
I never got past the first season for the animated one. I heard it was good though. I'll have to find out to what extent Bane is used.
Disney made it very clear that if it wasn't in a movie or a cartoon it wasn't cannon. Videogames, comics, novels, deleted scenes are now just legends.
It's a shame though since the Old Republic time period has n bearing on the movies Disney is doing, and it is one of my favorite parts of the Star Wars universe.
That doesn't mean Disney couldn't use one of their spin off movies to make one about the Old Republic era and make it cannon again.
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Nah, fuck that shit, if some kills my best homie, I'm doming that motherfucker ASAP, no matter who they are.Also, prepare for the feels.
Most videogames. The Kotor series is still canon, last I heard.
Evidence:
Kylo ren's lightsaber is confirmed to use parts from Revan's in it's construction, including the crystal.
Okay Wilger that's not how you cite evidence. If you want to prove people wrong on the internet you're expected to put in at least 30% more effort than that.
I need a source to verify.
Yeeeaaahhhh... You're gonna need to give us a source on that shit because if Revan's lightsaber was used in any way to make Kylo's Saber, I would have heard about it by now. Not only that, but there's literally no reason to make that part of the new trilogy. Even using part of a lightsaber from the old Republic Era, Revan's or someone else's, is a huge fucking deal for the canon nature of the EU, of which KOTOR is a part of. That's big because it calls into question Disney's blanket removal of the EU. That's not a shitstorm Disney wants to start up.
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Wilger, please respond with your source. I eagerly want to see your reaction to every active member of the forum calling you out.
Wilger's probably fled to Russia by now.